Yeardley: [00:00:01] Hey Super Podcast Fams, it’s Yeardley. I just wanted to pop in with a quick announcement about Small Town Dicks Season 12. It drops on April 21st. April 21st, mark your calendars. We will see you there.

Dave: [00:00:22] You look at Facebook and social media now, conspiracy theories start getting thrown out there, and all of a sudden, you have this huge convoluted story, when in reality, the truth is pretty simple.

Yeardley: [00:00:36] When a serious crime is committed in a small town, a handful of detectives are charged with solving the case. I’m Yeardley, and I’m fascinated by these stories. So, I invited my friends, detectives Dan and Dave, to help me gather the best true crime cases from around the country, and have the men and women who investigated them, tell us how it happened.

Dan: [00:01:01] I’m Dan.

Dave: [00:01:02] And I’m Dave.

Dan: [00:01:03] We’re identical twins.

Dave: [00:01:04] And we’re detectives in Small Town, USA.

Dan: [00:01:06] Dave investigates sex crimes and child abuse.

Dave: [00:01:09] Dan investigates violent crimes. And together, we’ve worked on hundreds of cases including assaults, robberies, murders, burglaries, sex abuse, and child abuse.

Dan: [00:01:18] Names, places, and certain details, including relationships have been altered to protect the privacy of the victims and their families. Though we realize that some of our listeners may be familiar with these cases, we hope you’ll join us in continuing to protect the true identities of those involved out of respect for what they’ve been through. Thank you.

Yeardley: [00:01:55] Today, you’re going to hear about a tragic case that happened in a very small town, and how that event tests the bonds of this tightknit community to its limit. The story is about a high school girl we call, Kelly, who goes out with trusted friends one night to check on some hog traps. It’s not an unusual activity in this rural town, but when an unpredictable event is met with fear and innocence, the consequences are devastating and the community is changed forever. This is Collateral.

[00:02:33] Today on Small Town Dicks, we have the usual suspects. We have Detective Dan.

Dan: [00:02:40] Good morning.

Yeardley: [00:02:40] Good morning. And Detective Dave.

Dave: [00:02:43] Great to be here.

Yeardley: [00:02:44] Great to have you. And we are so pleased to welcome a new guest to the podcast, Sheriff Carl.

Carl: [00:02:49] Thank you. Great to be here.

Yeardley: [00:02:51] Thank you for being here. So, Carl, before we get started, tell us a little bit about your jurisdiction. How big it is, how many sworn officers you have, what’s your set up?

Carl: [00:03:01] My county is actually a very rural county. I have 20 deputies. And, of course, at that time, we didn’t have maybe half of that. So, everyone, pretty much had to do their own work. You end up in a small jurisdiction like that, you wear a lot of different hats.

Dan: [00:03:20] So, your patrol deputies are doing their own follow up?

Carl: [00:03:22] Yes.

Dan: [00:03:23] They don’t forward it to a team of detectives. They go out and do their own investigations?

Carl: [00:03:28] Yeah. Well, at the time, I was the detective. I was the only one there.

Yeardley: [00:03:32] Wait, you were the only detective on duty when this crime happened?

Carl: [00:03:35] Yep.

Dave: [00:03:35] How big is your county?

Carl: [00:03:38] Ah, it’s 928 square miles.

Yeardley: [00:03:41] Wow.

Dave: [00:03:42] Not a whole lot of coverage, law enforcement wise. But the sheriff’s office, you’re on an island.  

Carl: [00:03:46] Yeah.

Yeardley: [00:03:47] That’s insane. So, tell us how and when this case came to you.

Carl: [00:03:52] This case happened way back in 2008, just two days before Christmas. It was probably one that as parents, as adults, it’s something that we don’t ever think twice about, but in this case, it just went horribly wrong. This is a story about Kelly. Kelly’s mom, she was a single parent. She had recently lost her husband, the year before in a car accident. They were just putting their life back together. Things were starting to get normal. She was a very popular girl, she was very outgoing. She was just really starting to get things going again.

Yeardley: [00:04:27] How old was she?

Carl: [00:04:28] She was 16 years old.

Yeardley: [00:04:30] Okay.

Carl: [00:04:31] Kelly had a friend, Wendy. They hung out together, they socialized at school, they leaned on each other for support. And Kelly’s mom was friends with Wendy’s mom. So, it’s pretty much like everyone knew each other there. Kelly wants to go over to Wendy’s house and spend the night, and this is something that they had done quite a bit. There’s just absolutely no red flags. It’s not like they were bad kids or anything like that.

[00:04:56] Now, they did have some friends that were friends of Wendy’s. Jordan and Mike were a couple of boys that they knew from school. None of them were, I say, boyfriend or girlfriend. They were just associates. They had been talking to Wendy and Kelly that night and said, “Would you like to go with us? We’re going to go check some hog traps.”

[00:05:19] Now, in a rural area like this, feral hogs are their problem. They go out and they destroy crops and stuff. So, it’s common practice out there to trap them. They were once domesticated hogs, but over a time period of a century, these have now become feral, and they multiply very, very quickly. They can devastate entire crops in just a very short amount of time.

Yeardley: [00:05:46] And do they travel in a pack, like a pack of wolves?

Carl: [00:05:48] Yes, they do.

Yeardley: [00:05:49] No way. How big? Are we talking, like 10 hogs, 30 hogs?

Carl: [00:05:53] Well, if you consider that the average sow can give birth to roughly nine piglets at a time.

Yeardley: [00:06:00] Oh my.

Carl: [00:06:01] If it goes on for a year, it could be a 100 to 200.

Yeardley: [00:06:05] Holy shit. And they would just descend on your crops and then you’re done?

Carl: [00:06:09] Yes. Cornfields are a favorite. And of course, we rely heavily on corn in the agricultural world. So, yes, these have become quite an issue.

Dan: [00:06:19] Are there even hunting restrictions on these hogs, or is it shoot on site?

Carl: [00:06:24] It is shoot on site. They are considered a nuisance animal now. In fact, in a presentation last year from the Parks and Wildlife, they said, “You will not be able to shoot them into control. You will have to take other measures.”

Yeardley: [00:06:37] Interesting. Can you then describe briefly what is a hog trap? If you’re dealing with those kinds of numbers, how can you possibly contain that?

Carl: [00:06:45] Well, in this case, the hog trap can be anywhere from maybe 4ft by 5ft long, and that would be like a single hog trap. A multiple hog trap can be as large as a couple of 100ft by a couple of 100ft.

Yeardley: [00:07:01] Is it like a Havahart trap? Like if you have a raccoon who’s harassing you in the city, you can get a Havahart trap, which is you set the bait, the raccoon or the possum goes into the cage, and the cage closes behind them, but the animal isn’t hurt, per se. Then you can relocate the thing.

Carl: [00:07:17] You know what? That is a very good analogy. That’s exactly what it looks like. There is a market for live feral hogs.

Yeardley: [00:07:26] Really?

Carl: [00:07:27] Yes.

Dan: [00:07:27] Hunting ranches.

Carl: [00:07:28] Yes, hunting ranches. They buy them to hunt. So, there is a market to trap them live and that’s what this particular trap was. It was a live trap. There’s maybe 50 to 60 hogs in this particular trap. So, the hog trap is usually set, and it may stay set for two to three days. It’s usually in the evening or at night, when the pack moves in, this particular one was filled with old corn husk and things like that that would attract the hog. So, there’s maybe 50 to 60 hogs in this particular trap.

Yeardley: [00:08:09] Whose hog trap is it? Is it Mike’s hog trap?

Carl: [00:08:11] It actually belongs to a third party, a farmer, and he hires Mike and Jordan to trap these hogs. So, they want to go check the traps. If there’s hogs in there, make sure the gate is locked. So, in the morning when they come out, they can remove them and sell them. Mike was in his early 20s and Jordan was a family friend. He was only 15.

Yeardley: [00:08:34] Okay.

Carl: [00:08:35] But they had hunted together on several occasions. In fact, they had checked this trap earlier that night. They were going to go back and check it again because the evidence was going to show that there was going to be hogs in that area, so they were looking to have that trap fall. They are very aggressive animals. They are very dangerous. And usually, whenever they are being hunted or whenever you’re trying to even capture them, it is not uncommon at all to be armed because things do go bad.

Dave: [00:09:06] So, this is basically the boys hanging out with the teenage girls and they’re just going out, this is an entertainment type thing?

Carl: [00:09:13] Yes. They go out and they check these traps. They come up to this one particular trap. This is a large one. And sure enough, this time, the trap is full. So, they park the truck that is facing into the trap itself, so that they could see exactly what was in there. So, Jordan gets out to make sure that the gate that controls the flow of the hogs is locked and closed. Well, as soon as he gets there, one of the hogs charges it and breaks the gate.

Yeardley: [00:09:43] Oh.

Carl: [00:09:44] Jordan’s armed with a rifle and he starts shooting at the hogs. But the more he shoots at them, the more the hogs start to panic and run towards him. So, now, he’s running backwards and shooting. Jordan gets almost 10ft to the truck when he trips and discharges around, and it strikes Kelly in the forehead and kills her.

Yeardley: [00:10:11] [gasps] Oh, my God.

Dave: [00:10:13] Is she in the truck or is she outside?

Carl: [00:10:15] Kelly is sitting in the middle seat with Wendy sitting closest to the window. Wendy had leaned forward just enough at the time of the shot, and Kelly, who was sitting in the middle ended up catching the bullet.

Dave: [00:10:33] Just a horrible, freak accident.

Dave: [00:10:49] Did they realize right away that Kelly’s been hit or is there a kind of the where you check yourself, “Hey, is everybody okay?” And then you turn around and there’s someone dead right there?

Carl: [00:10:58] Wendy and Mike knew right away. Wendy was covered in blood. It was classic of a high-powered rifle headshot. It was what you would expect to see.

Yeardley: [00:11:06] What would you expect to see? Obviously, it’s blood everywhere, but is that a tidy bullet wound or is it much messier than that?

Dave: [00:11:15] High velocity round like that would be devastating. It’s not a tiny little hole.

Dan: [00:11:19] That’s a lot of damage. Big wound.

Carl: [00:11:22] Yeah. They immediately panicked. Of course, Jordan still had hogs coming at him. So, after the rifle discharged, he dropped it and then jumped into the back of the truck to get away from the hogs. And by this time, everyone’s already screaming that Kelly had been hit.

Dan: [00:11:42] That’s absolute chaos.

Carl: [00:11:44] Oh, yes. The scene just absolutely showed that there was all kinds of panic at the time. So, we did receive a 911 call.

Yeardley: [00:11:52] Who made the call?

Carl: [00:11:53] Mike, maybe the original, but Wendy was also calling at the same time. So, that’s how much chaos was going on.

Yeardley: [00:12:02] Wow. And you’ve brought us Mike’s 911 call to our audience. The recording is really hard to hear in some places. So, we will translate.

Operator: [00:12:16] This is a 911 operator.

Mike: [00:12:18] Yeah.

Operator: [00:12:19] Okay. My understanding, there’s a female has been shot.

Mike: [00:12:21] Yes.

Operator: [00:12:22] Okay. Can you tell me where you’re at? Do you know the address or anything?

Mike: [00:12:26] I don’t know anything about it. I don’t really know.

Operator: [00:12:29] You’re not on the scene after where she died?

Mike: [00:12:32] Yes, I am, but I have no clue where we are.

Yeardley: [00:12:34] Mike says, “Yes, I am, but I have no clue where we are.”

Operator: [00:12:39] How badly is she where she shot at?

Mike: [00:12:41] In her head.

Operator: [00:12:43] In the what?

Mike: [00:12:43] In her head.

Operator: [00:12:44] In her head. Is she still breathing?

Mike: [00:12:48] No, ma’am. She’s gone.

Operator: [00:12:50] She’s not breathing?

Mike: [00:12:51] She’s dead, ma’am.

Yeardley: [00:12:53] She’s dead, ma’am.

[background noise] [beep]

Operator: [00:12:58] I’ve got units on the way. Somebody go to gate and show them off to where to go in there.

Mike: [00:13:05] I’ve got nothing here, ma’am. She’s in the back seat now.

Yeardley: [00:13:09] She’s in the back seat now.

Operator: [00:13:12] She’s in the back seat?

Mike: [00:13:13] Yes, ma’am is.

Operator: [00:13:13] And she is not breathing at all?

Mike: [00:13:15] Ma’am, she’s dead.

Operator: [00:13:17] Okay, sir, I understand. We’re just going to make sure, okay?

Mike: [00:13:20] I understand. Also, I have never, ever been through this in my life.

Operator: [00:13:24] I understand.

Yeardley: [00:13:25] I understand. Also, I have never, ever been through this in my life.

Carl: [00:13:36] When they trying to describe where they were, because they were in a middle of a field, they’re trying to describe where the ambulance should go. They make arrangements to get out to a county road where they will meet the ambulance.

Yeardley: [00:13:50] And how long does that take that ambulance to arrive?

Carl: [00:13:54] I think it took the ambulance less than seven minutes to get there. They weren’t far out of town. It just goes to show under pressure. These kids just did not know where they were or what they were doing.

Dave: [00:14:06] Right. Most people, when they’re driving around, aren’t making note of mile markers or landmark intersections. So, all of a sudden, something bad happens and somebody says, “Well, where are you?” And you’re like, “Umm.”

Yeardley: [00:14:19] Sure. So, there’s chaos. Two people are calling 911. Are we assuming that hogs are now also surrounding the truck, because they’ve breached their pen?

Carl: [00:14:27] Oh, yes. They’re actually running past. They’re trying to get away. So, they’re not necessarily attacking, but there’s this big rush of hogs–

Dan: [00:14:35] It’s a stampede.

Carl: [00:14:36] Yeah, it’s basically a hog stampede. Believe it or not, they can move very fast. So, the kids are driving to meet this ambulance. When they do end up at the county road, they see the ambulance, they pull over, and it is apparent that Kelly is dead. There’s no doubt. Wendy is in absolute hysterics. Jordan just has his blank look on his face. He knows it happened, but he doesn’t understand what’s going on. He can’t believe it’s happening. And Mike, on the other hand, he’s concerned with the condition of his truck because it’s a mess.

Yeardley: [00:15:13] What?

Carl: [00:15:15] Yes, he is concerned. He wanted to know what was going to happen with his truck.

Yeardley: [00:15:19] Less concerned for Kelly being deceased and more concerned for the interior of his vehicle.

Carl: [00:15:25] Absolutely. And that really did draw suspicion on the case because that’s just not a normal reaction. We think that as regular people, who cares about a truck?

Yeardley: [00:15:35] Right.

Carl: [00:15:36] His concern was on that. So, we started wondering, was there some sort of connection between Kelly and Mike? Was there some sort of connection between Kelly and Jordan? Was this something that we needed to look at as a possible homicide or are we talking about a true accident? At that time, we didn’t know. So, we had to start at the beginning.

Dave: [00:15:56] So, you guys get contacted shortly after medical personnel or contacted the ambulance. And now, really, you have two crime scenes. You have a crime scene in the truck and you have a crime scene where the hogs busted out of the gate.

Carl: [00:16:11] Yes.

Dave: [00:16:12] So, now you’ve got a small county with limited resources, one detective, and now you got two crime scenes. How do you manage that?

Carl: [00:16:21] That was the challenge that we had. I received the call, they called me from the house. I went out to the scene, and that’s exactly what I had. There was an ambulance with the truck, there was a girl that is obviously deceased inside. But then about another mile away, I had a crime scene with shell casings, a rifle, the evidence of the crime. So, we had to go back and try to reconstruct that. And at the same time process the scene where Kelly was.

Yeardley: [00:16:49] Jordan seems to be in a daze, when does he let you know, “It was me and it was my fault and it was an accident.”

Carl: [00:16:54] It didn’t come around until a few hours into it.

Yeardley: [00:16:59] Really?

Carl: [00:16:59] Yes. You could tell that Jordan was not being deceptive. He was just in disbelief, which was, I hate to say it was to my advantage processing the scene, because I had my hands full with the crime scene. So, I’m trying to get that locked down. Then by the time I’m able to talk to Jordan, he had calmed down enough, and he just goes, “Oh, my God, I shot her. I didn’t mean to.” By the time we get out there, of course, I believe it was Wendy that was making the phone calls. Wendy called her home, mom, and said, “Hey, we’re out here at this hog trap and Kelly’s dead.” And she said, “What do you mean? You’re supposed to be in bed.”

Dave: [00:17:42] They snuck out, right?

Carl: [00:17:43] Yeah.

Dan: [00:17:43] Are they out drinking on back roads?

Carl: [00:17:46] Alcohol was not a factor in this one. That’s very odd.

Dan: [00:17:50] Yeah.

Carl: [00:17:50] But, yes, alcohol was not a factor in this. The girls didn’t drink. They weren’t known to drink. Mike was known to drink, but he hadn’t been drinking that night, mostly because he needed to be on his toes for dealing with these hog traps.

Dan: [00:18:05] He has a healthy respect for what they can do to you.

Carl: [00:18:08] Yes.

Dave: [00:18:08] And so, prior to hearing about this phone call to Wendy’s mother, I was thinking, who gives this death notification? You’re giving it to Kelly’s mother, who’s already by herself, because her husband’s dead and now you have handed her another horrible situation.

Yeardley: [00:18:25] Two days before Christmas.

Dave: [00:18:26] Right.

Carl: [00:18:27] Yes. As it turned out, when Wendy called her mom, Wendy’s mom called Kelly’s mom.

Dave: [00:18:35] And so that’s how the news breaks.

Carl: [00:18:36] That’s how it broke. We all met at the local hospital. They did not transport Kelly from the scene. Of course, she was deceased.

Yeardley: [00:18:45] They took her to the morgue instead?

Carl: [00:18:47] Yes. So, we had to have some place where we could get this now growing onslaught of people together. All of Kelly’s friends. Like I said, she was a popular girl in school. It took about 10 minutes for this to spread around. We had a large group. So, we had the group meet at the hospital, which turned out to be a good thing, because Kelly’s mom, she needed medical attention. She had broken beyond. We were also having Wendy evaluated, because she’s covered in blood and we don’t know if she’s injured.

Dave: [00:19:20] Right. And now you’re out at a crime scene, and you’re worried about containment, evidence, getting your statements from the involved people who are now spread out, and you’ve also got hogs that are on the loose. So, you’re dealing with a lot.

Carl: [00:19:35] Yeah, and it was about to get busier.

Carl: [00:20:23] We had a homicide. Now, whether it was intentional or whether it was accidental, we didn’t know at that time. I had about a two-and-a-half-hour drive ahead of me the next morning for an autopsy. So, I needed to wrap up this crime scene and then get on the road to the autopsy.

Yeardley: [00:20:40] And do you take Jordan into custody?

Carl: [00:20:44] No, we never took Jordan into custody. We did have questions for him, but now, we’re looking at him, is he a suspect or is he a witness? State law dictates that if we’re going to interview a minor, which Jordan was, we would need to have him magistrated prior to doing so.

Yeardley: [00:21:03] What is that?

Carl: [00:21:04] Magistrating is basically where we take the juvenile, the underage person, in front of a magistrate, a judge, and they advise them of their legal rights. We could have talked to him without a magistrate. However, any evidence that would have been collected if he had in fact been a suspect, we would not have been able to use.

Dan: [00:21:28] As you’re searching this crime scene where the hog trap is, you have a decent grasp on what these people are saying happened. What you’re looking at this crime scene is matching up?

Carl: [00:21:39] Oh, yes. We marked out the shell casings and you can actually see where he was walking. We called it “walking the scene.” It’s a progression of shell casings that, as they are being ejected, are landing in a pattern that match what he is telling us he did.

Yeardley: [00:21:55] Which is that he was walking backward away from the hogs.

Carl: [00:21:58] Yeah. And then we have one round that comes in low through the side of the truck, and then the trajectory is almost straight up, which is consistent with the injury that Kelly had suffered. It was a very close shot for a high-powered rifle. Very close shot.

Dan: [00:22:17] What caliber, .223?

Carl: [00:22:19] Yeah, it was a .223.

Yeardley: [00:22:20] And so, at what point do you determine that Jordan is telling the truth that it was accidental? How does that unfold? And then this seems like a very small community. The ripple effect must have been enormous.

Carl: [00:22:32] It was almost like the ripple tsunami. Of course, everyone had an opinion as to what went on out there. You can let your imagination run wild with what they felt had happened. It was a bad gambling debt, that it was a love triangle, that it was jealousy, it was revenge. It was an accident. That’s what happened. Of course, the scene showed it, the interviews showed it, and the autopsy and the other forensic interview showed it. So, once we were able to conclusively say that this was an accidental shooting, then all of a sudden, the rumor stopped.

Yeardley: [00:23:11] So, they believed you.

Carl: [00:23:12] Yes.

Dave: [00:23:12] You think about it, it only took a few minutes for the whole community of these high school age kids to know, and there’s going to be people out there– You look at Facebook and social media now, the conspiracy theories start getting thrown out there, and all of a sudden, you have this huge convoluted story, when in reality, it’s actually a pretty simple story, and the truth is pretty simple.

Yeardley: [00:23:36] Right.

Dan: [00:23:37] Which is something we’ve talked about on this podcast before as we caution our victims’ families, please don’t get on social media and spread any type of conjecture. But it doesn’t always stop people.

Carl: [00:23:47] That’s where we find that most of these cases get off track is that the story is more sensational than the truth.

Yeardley: [00:23:56] When you finally have a chance to sit down with Jordan, what is his affect? What’s that interview like?

Carl: [00:24:02] Well, Jordan was more than willing to talk. He never held back at all. He was scared. He was also feeling a lot of guilt. It was a type of guilt, and anyone that’s ever done a forensic interview can tell, you can see it on them. You can literally see how bad they feel. He cried a lot. He got sick couple of times. He was feeling it pretty bad because it come to find out, they were friends. They had grown up together, they were small children together, and they were adolescents together. While they were never romantically connected, they did share a bond that was a friendship. And so, it would be the same way as if anyone else would have lost a dear friend, except you’re the one who took their life.

Dave: [00:24:47] Yeah, you feel horrible. And then as a detective, you’re gauging all these different reactions. And then you’ve got Mike. His concern is the interior of his truck and how it’s going to get clean. So, you have to gauge that while you’re also filtering through all these facts and circumstances. And so, I imagine after seeing Jordan, his reaction, I mean, it’s genuine and it’s appropriate, and you go, “Okay, this kid is not lying to me.” But what is going on with Mike?

Yeardley: [00:25:15] Did that ever change? Does his focus and his concern ever shift to, “Oh, shit”?

Carl: [00:25:21] Well, that’s what we were looking for. We were expecting that to happen because, okay, your initial reaction may not tell your entire personality with it, “Well, who’s going to clean up my truck?” That may be the initial reaction, but then after it sinks in, you’re like, “Oh, who gives, you know, about my truck? Oh, my God, there’s a dead girl in my truck.” We figured that within the hour, within a day, within a week that his stance on the truck would probably diminish that he would be like, “Oh, my God, we had lost Kelly. I can’t believe it.”

Yeardley: [00:25:56] And?

Carl: [00:25:57] It did not happen.

Yeardley: [00:25:58] What?

Dan: [00:25:59] So, this truck is a crime scene. Did you tow it from the scene?

Carl: [00:26:02] Yes.

Dan: [00:26:03] So, it’s impounded, basically?

Carl: [00:26:05] Yes.

Dan: [00:26:05] And you guys are processing it? Is he calling you about every day saying, “When am I going to get my truck back?”

Carl: [00:26:11] Yes. He wants to know when he’s going to get his truck back.

Dan: [00:26:14] The reason why I asked that question is because I already knew the answer.

Carl: [00:26:16] Yeah, you did. [chuckles] He wanted to know when he was going to get it back. Of course, he had contacted his insurance company. Basically, “It’s not my blood and I didn’t shoot her. So, why should I have to clean up?”

Yeardley: [00:26:28] That is so shocking to me.

Carl: [00:26:30] Yeah. And we ended up calling him Cold Mike. And he was not exactly a friend to the others. He knew them. He was older. But I was just really taken aback by his lack of concern for anything other than a piece of machinery.

Yeardley: [00:26:47] That’s incredible.

Yeardley: [00:27:34] You said that, when the town assembled at the hospital, it turned out to be a good thing, because Kelly’s mom needed medical attention, because I’m assuming she was just absolutely devastated?

Carl: [00:27:45] That’s exactly right. She had broke down immediately. At the time, we didn’t know that she had lost her husband almost a year to the day prior too.

Yeardley: [00:27:55] Oh, God.

Carl: [00:27:56] So, this was just like a double whammy for her. It’s like, “What else can you do to her?” You lose your husband, next year, you’re going to lose your daughter, and it was her only child.

Dave: [00:28:06] I’m hoping that the community surrounds her and supports her.

Carl: [00:28:10] She’s well-loved within her community and there was a great outpouring.

Yeardley: [00:28:15] Did anything ever happen to Jordan? Was he charged with anything or–?

Carl: [00:28:20] We did send the case to a grand jury. Jordan was never charged with anything. There could have been a charge of reckless discharge of a firearm. However, the evidence at the scene suggested that it was accidental, that he wasn’t being reckless, he just fell. And that’s what caused the firearm to discharge. It was presented to a grand jury. A grand jury did what we called a no bill. In other words, they refused to return an indictment on him based upon those facts.

Dave: [00:28:48] I’m happy about that. You think about the greater good. There’s no intent here, and he’s not being negligent. This kid’s overwhelmed by dangerous animals coming at him, trying to protect himself, and something bad happens. And an indictment, in my opinion, in that situation, be horrible. That just compounds everything.

Dan: [00:29:09] I don’t think that’s in the spirit of the law at all.

Dave: [00:29:12] Right.

Yeardley: [00:29:13] And, Carl, we always ask our guests, you’ve been in law enforcement for a long time. What is it about this case that stands out to you?

Carl: [00:29:23] The main thing that stands out to me in this case is just how fragile life is.

Yeardley: [00:29:30] Hmm.

Carl: [00:29:30] Because how many times have you went to the grocery store? How many times have you went over to a friend’s house? How many times have you ever told your children, “Goodbye, I’ll see you this afternoon,” and they never, ever come back. And that’s what was the main issue in this case. Look how fragile life was. Mom was letting her daughter go spend the night with her friend and they were just going to watch movies. That was it.

Yeardley: [00:29:56] Like they’ve done a hundred times before.

Carl: [00:29:58] Yes. So, if you can imagine that that is your mindset, that as far as you know, your daughter is over at her friend’s house, her friend, mom’s friend is the mom, and so, you know she’s in good place, and then all of a sudden, she gets a phone call, “Your daughter’s dead. She’s on the side of a road.” That is the reality of that case. Look how fragile life really is.

Yeardley: [00:30:21] Right. Having suffered back-to-back devastating losses, Kelly’s mom, first, her husband in a car crash, and then her daughter, almost a year to the day, and also right next to Christmas, do you know how she’s doing now, and how is the town and all the people who are involved in this incident?

Carl: [00:30:38] Just like with any community, you’ll always feel the loss, but at some point, you always say, “Well, when are they going to get over it?” And the truth is, you don’t get over it. You just learn to deal with it. I’d say, at some point, you have to learn to make friends with it. You have to accept that this is how it is and this is how it’s going to be. This is the same with this community. They accepted it and they have moved on from there. Mom didn’t fare too well. I would say, Jordan didn’t fare too well. Mike is the same. He’s got a new truck.

Yeardley: [00:31:11] That’s cold.

Carl: [00:31:12] Yeah, that’s one of those cases where does it stay in your heart. And that’s another thing that says it’s like, “What difference does this truck make in the scheme of anything?” The loss of the life, the loss of a young life like that impacts the community and it impacts the investigator too. I tell you, yeah, I do carry that one, because there’s not a Christmas that goes by that I don’t think about Kelly.

Yeardley: [00:31:36] Thank you so much, Carl. We’re always so grateful to hear the inside story of these cases that often go unnoticed unless you are part of that community, and we really appreciate you bringing that to us today.

Carl: [00:31:49] Yeah, it’s my pleasure.

Yeardley: [00:31:50] Thank you.

[music]

Yeardley: [00:32:03] Coming up on the next Small Town Dicks, our very own Detective Dave shares two particularly difficult cases of abuse that got under his skin and changed him forever. Pariah, available beginning September 27h. Don’t miss it.

[00:32:29] Small Town Dicks is produced by Gary Scott and Yeardley Smith, and coproduced by Detectives Dan and Dave. This episode was edited by Logan Heftel, Gary Scott, and me, Yeardley Smith. Our associate producers are Erin Gaynor and the Real Nick Smitty. Our music is composed by John Forest. Our editors extraordinaire are Logan Heftel and Soren Begin, and our books are cooked and cats wrangled by Ben Cornwell.

Dan: [00:32:56] If you like what you hear and want to stay up to date with the show, visit us on our website at smalltowndicks.com. And join the Small Town Fam by following us on Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter at @smalltowndicks. We love hearing from you.

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Yeardley: [00:33:24] That’s right. Your subscription also makes it possible for us to keep going to small towns across the country-

Dan: [00:33:30] -in search of the finest-

Dave: [00:33:32] -rare-

Dan: [00:33:32] -true crime cases told, as always by the detectives who investigated them.

Dave: [00:33:37] So, thanks for listening, Small Town Fam.

Yeardley: [00:33:39] Nobody’s better than you.

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